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 Tolerating the Intolerant

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Daktoria



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PostSubject: Tolerating the Intolerant   Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:25 am

Hello. I was invited here by insightfoul from ILP. You guys seem to have a pretty organized community here.

Anyway, I just had a classic question in mind. How are the tolerant supposed to deal with the intolerant when the intolerant are stronger than the tolerant by default, and the intolerant accuse the tolerant of being hypocrites for not tolerating the intolerant?

The question at hand is a practical one. Is there an argumentation style that can trigger behavior in intolerant people's minds even if it isn't entirely logical?
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Imafungi
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PostSubject: Re: Tolerating the Intolerant   Sun Jan 26, 2014 1:26 pm

Daktoria wrote:
Hello.  I was invited here by insightfoul from ILP.  You guys seem to have a pretty organized community here.

Anyway, I just had a classic question in mind.  How are the tolerant supposed to deal with the intolerant when the intolerant are stronger than the tolerant by default, and the intolerant accuse the tolerant of being hypocrites for not tolerating the intolerant?

The question at hand is a practical one.  Is there an argumentation style that can trigger behavior in intolerant people's minds even if it isn't entirely logical?

Well this is pretty much the idea of law, government, society, community, family. If someone is intolerant of something, and you think that is illogical of them, how is what you think correct/how can you prove it just and correct, and why should you have the power to tell or show or force another person to think or feel a certain way? Do you have an example?
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Fixed Cross
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PostSubject: Re: Tolerating the Intolerant   Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:42 pm

Daktoria wrote:
Hello.  I was invited here by insightfoul from ILP.  You guys seem to have a pretty organized community here.

Anyway, I just had a classic question in mind.  How are the tolerant supposed to deal with the intolerant when the intolerant are stronger than the tolerant by default, and the intolerant accuse the tolerant of being hypocrites for not tolerating the intolerant?

The question at hand is a practical one.  Is there an argumentation style that can trigger behavior in intolerant people's minds even if it isn't entirely logical?

I find the only solution to this problem is to be absurdly intolerant towards intolerance, even to thge point of disacknowledging the existence of the excessively intolerant person. Reflect it back to the intolerant in a way even his traumatized, looping mind can perceive. You can not reason with a fundamentally intolerant person, you can only coerce them into feeling the truth of a matter.

Basically you have to point the intolerant to the fact that his judgment, whether tolerant or not, ends with his person. Tolerance is a consensus, not a given. So all we can do is deny the fact that this intolerant perspective exists - negate it. Tolerance is not a cardinal virtue, it's a derived one. So you can fuck around with its logic without compromising its effect.

 

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" The strong do what they can do and the weak accept what they have to accept. "
- Thucydides
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PostSubject: Re: Tolerating the Intolerant   Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:59 pm

Insightfoul got banned along with the whole "Satyr" circus because his capacity for discourse was so far below the standard that he could only soil the place, decrease the density of quality, value on this board. I find this whole lot intolerant of the very idea of text. The younger ones occasionally show glimpses of honesty and potential, but in general they attack a text as if they know what it says before they read it. This is repressing self-valuing to the subconscious, and utilizing the waking mind strictly for the purpose of ruining everything that is fertile in their subconscious - a kind of suicide in the closet.

Many people use their above average intellect to destroy their instincts. Because many people with above average intellects - at least many who pride themselves on such intellect -  have weak bodies and degenerate instincts. But the word we get done here is strictly unifying, it does not allow for the kind of dishonesty and self-rape that passes for profundity in the more depraved sections of the internet philosophy game.

 

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" The strong do what they can do and the weak accept what they have to accept. "
- Thucydides
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Meryl

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PostSubject: Re: Tolerating the Intolerant   Wed Jul 02, 2014 4:01 am

In my view

The world is diverse, diverse means different thoughts, social background, ethics/moral views, experiences and how the individual reacts to them and it goes on and on.

Past experience has taught me that unless you desire to 'conform' with what is considered as 'intolerant' to you, you are going to become a social outcast disregarded from the 'common society' because you think that your level of thinking, your quality of experience and the like is far more superior than what the 'common society' dictates thus bringing forth intolerance and isolation. Then again is that really a curse and are you going to be as isolated as you are really thinking?
Obviously 'conforming' on the other hand requires a little bit of thought into it.
Are you conforming because you fear judgment maybe fear of being left alone, or maybe persecution and another amount of things that different societies contain within?
What if you are actually 'conforming' because you are sure you can gain something from it? Is that actually also intolerant and worthy of judgment? For example, I personally conform because I am otherwise sure that I'll gain something from it.
However if I  choose 'conformation' to a certain branch of ideals, thoughts, beliefs because of fear of wrong judgment and rejection I am also probably on the wrong track in my opinion and will still be viewed as a coward.

Now, so as not to deviate too much off topic.
Every individual defines 'intolerant' in a different manner thus creating conflict with other individuals because they are otherwise 'tolerant' towards what you consider as 'intolerant' and vice-versa for you.
I have figured that atheists are intolerant towards brainwashed/indoctrinated religious, and vice versa. I do not see why this should be. An atheist should listen to the rants of a religious since there is always something worthy of understanding, and likewise the other way around without the actual need of conversion whatsoever. The funny thing is that the indoctrinated is being otherwise 'intolerant' towards the atheist but still 'tolerant' as in listening and arguing with a individual of such a belief, and vice-versa. That's only an example there are many more.

Even if you had to build and brainwash enough individuals to actually become more 'tolerant' to your mindset or belief you are deluding yourselves. Because of an individuals diverse reaction to their environment and their experiences, you will always find an individual that is 'intolerant' of whatever you believe.
Hence, you don't 'tolerate' the 'intolerant' you conform towards the 'intolerant' if you are sure or near to sure that there is something to gain from it, otherwise you would just disregard these individuals completely as it is most likely such individuals dull out your way of thinking or give you negative reactions.

Ok, on a brighter note, I've come back after a very long time on this forum and this is probably my first post. I did not find an 'introductions' section so the layout kind of confused me in a way. Let us also forget about how I got here and found out about the existence of such a place. I'm not really here to argue personal matters, I'm here to argue logically, philosophically, theologically and whatever else may be considered as worthy of arguing whilst improving my knowledge and mindset.

 

___________
"A thousand times we die in one life. We crumble, break and tear apart until the layers of illusion are burned away and all that is left, is the truth of who and what we really are" - Teal Scott
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Thrasymachus
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PostSubject: Re: Tolerating the Intolerant   Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:46 am

There is no introductions section, but welcome.

Every noble thinker has rejected conformity to norms of social tolerance, because such norms represent only the absence of thinking, the absence of a self. Rather it would wish to or not truth isolates itself until it can find affinity with its own kind, rather in books, nature, art or wherever.

What is called tolerance today is only a symptom of the continuing degeneration of the human heart. This kind of tolerance will only persist so long as these forms of weakness continue to be socially relevant. No self-valuing can continue to fail to select healthy experiences for itself and live very much longer; the "feeling of the will to power" as Nietzsche called it has been used against the self to cultivate all manner of self-destructions, a parallel to developments in the mind and heart of a growing conscience except that such a conscience is capable of living out the many phases of death through which it must pass along its trajectory of growth- the physical individual of course is not. So such a process mirrored in the substance of society must persist across many generations of depraved individuals, leaving a large swath of destruction behind it.

Ignorance is only the form of self-protection assumed by the individual with respect to such a process against which he feels powerless.

 

___________
"We must, now armed with such a language, realize the “transcendental unity of ideas,” through a new morality that aims, not to hypostasize experience and grasp in positive knowledge a series of particular virtues and vices, but rather to fully explicate this continuity; where philosophy exists to represent this transcendental order, morality most exist to mediate the two spheres, the spheres of experience and ideality." --Parodites

"Between this sky and the faces turned toward it there is nothing on which to hang a mythology, a literature, an ethic, or a religion—only stones, flesh, stars, and those truths the hand can touch." --Camus
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