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 He that is most gracious, most merciful

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Fixed Cross
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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Thu Feb 09, 2017 7:59 pm

And since I am a philosopher, any unproven claim that god doesn't exists... is just another religion.

 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:07 pm

Fixed Cross wrote:
And since I am a philosopher, any unproven claim that god doesn't exists... is just another religion.

No, not a religion. An understanding.

That argument has been presented to me before. I cannot prove something does not exist. You know that. But I have seen no proof that any do exist.

Our individual understanding are what they are. Sometimes we add beliefs without the understanding.

I won't argue against the fact the you believe they/it exists.

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:32 pm

But Ive presented rational arguments that they do exist, as causators.
The belief wouldnt be there if there wasnt an object to the belief.
;
lets say a god is 'arrival on the other side' before one jumps.
One has faith that this god will exists, and so one takes a leap of faith.

Then, when it works out - the god has become more powerful.
This then shows in increased boldness, and this begins to magnetize people with this god.

I have gradually come to see that we are more guided by the future than by the past. This is our true difference from animals. It is what "reason" is -
and god is the apex of this "reason" -

"A" = "A" is a definition of Gods existence - namely of faith that the outcome based on only faith is going to be correct - and organizing all ones further actions around that faith. Math is god, as the Greeks, Arabs and Renaissance scientists knew.

But I created another god, in 2011.

 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:33 pm

Ill repeat that I do not believe in a creator god, or in the big bang. Gods are concoctions of selfvaluing logic just as we are.

 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:34 pm

Or, if you want to call selfvaluing logic god, that's fine with me.
But in that case god is splintered and shattered and cant help himself, and has no clue about himself -
he just is, like a rabid infant trying at best to crawl partially back into the womb, the dark.

Splinters of god could shine, propel themselves through potential as joyful fulfillment thereof - but god would be mad, sad, and wishing he was dead.

 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:41 pm

I think this is why binary systems work best - like sex, or electricity, or digital code.
They divide the absolute impossibility for universality to apply stably to itself, into a code of two, which harbors and wields the enormous turbulence of the primordial potential within itself through inventing the form of its negation, which births time, and stable unfolding.

Unfolding of what? Of whatever, as long as it is stable.
It ends up as nothing except that it inadvertently has then existed -



 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:46 pm

An ontological base line of which myths are acknowledgement, and of which god is an abstraction. An integrated function of futility and time within the correspondence field of self-valuing logic, which always births more than what is useful, and existence is more than what is useful.

Self-valuing logic is chaos-logic.

You can use it to predict any kind of butterfly effect, which is a stacking of spin, and spin is the friction of being against itself, in the duality I described above.





And yes I meant to write futility and not utility, but as I emphasize this, I realize that utility and futility are ultimately the same.
What is not futile is what is not there to be used - that for which other things are used to bring it about. A child, before it becomes 'a responsible person', would be such a thing.

 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:10 am

This will be my last post to this concept because I don't want anyone thinking that I am trying to influence people to discard their belief in gods or their religion.

Fixed Cross wrote:
But Ive presented rational arguments that they do exist, as causators.
The belief wouldnt be there if there wasnt an object to the belief.

But you have not presented an object. Yes, the rational argument is there but there is no object. Cause and effect doesn't work because we will never be able to see back further than the Big Bang to determine what caused the "Bang". In other words; we will never "know" the primal cause.

lets say a god is 'arrival on the other side' before one jumps.
One has faith that this god will exists, and so one takes a leap of faith.

And that is what it is: A leap of faith. Nothing more.

Then, when it works out - the god has become more powerful.
This then shows in increased boldness, and this begins to magnetize people with this god.

What worked out and why? Yes, the faith became stronger but it didn't materialize any gods. Only the mental concept.

I have gradually come to see that we are more guided by the future than by the past. This is our true difference from animals. It is what "reason" is -
and god is the apex of this "reason" -

You strayed to a different concept. (I go off topic all the time too.) Yes, our brain is capable of fabricating illusions and delusions. Many of these are applied to our ideals of what the future "could be". But if they are not compatible with reality then all they become are pipe dreams.

"A" = "A" is a definition of Gods existence - namely of faith that the outcome based on only faith is going to be correct - and organizing all ones further actions around that faith. Math is god, as the Greeks, Arabs and Renaissance scientists knew.


Totally illogical and irrational. "A" = "A". That is all. It does not infer anything else. Primal Cause cannot be defined. This is because it existed prior to anything existing. Therefore it did not exist prior to existence. It nullifies itself.


But I created another god, in 2011.

I cannot argue this because I cannot imagine your mental creations.

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:12 am

Fixed Cross wrote:
Ill repeat that I do not believe in a creator god, or in the big bang. Gods are concoctions of selfvaluing logic just as we are.

This is almost close enough for me to agree with. My disagreement is in the need to even associate "self-valuing logic" with an illogical concept.
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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:53 am

Prozac and CNN never founded a world, nor fundamentally evolved the human subjectivity and spirit. Christianity did do those things, for all its flaws too of course.

Believing in imaginary friends is useful for ordinary people who lack intellectual hardness. The problem now is that Christianity is begging for the next stage beyond itself, so that Christianity will not need to atrophy into a dying specter and end up forsaking its own ideals in a protracted death. Christianity knows it needs to give birth to the next stage, but the postmodern new age leftist religion of Prozac CNN transhumanism is trying to force the ugly death upon Christianity, by turning it into something terrible... atheism is just one part of that. A real atheist has no reason to call himself an atheist, and no reason to try converting people to the new religion of the transhumanism Jesus-VR-Welfare world.

Disney is the new face of transhumanist PC neoliberal atheism and mindrape, masking itself as the smile of Jesus.

 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 12:34 pm

Sisyphus "A" = "A" is superstition. It projects a belief into the future, and then coerces the mathematician to absolutely believe in the justified outcome of this belief.

Why? Because there is no equality between objects in the world that can just be asserted by positing a letter. It's baloney. But baloney has its uses.

We can make another topic about this elsewhere. I respect your decision not to continue on this topic. I don't think Ive been understood very well, and thats fine. I would not even object to being scorned and ridiculed for espousing the very thing that in so many ways stands between man and philosophy.


Thrasymachus -

"Prozac and CNN never founded a world, nor fundamentally evolved the human subjectivity and spirit. Christianity did do those things, for all its flaws too of course."

Yes.
I always sensed there was more to Christianity than what N says there is, but it took Parodites to penetrate into the logic of that.

"Believing in imaginary friends is useful for ordinary people who lack intellectual hardness. The problem now is that Christianity is begging for the next stage beyond itself, so that Christianity will not need to atrophy into a dying specter and end up forsaking its own ideals in a protracted death. Christianity knows it needs to give birth to the next stage,"

This is supremely relevant... and I think Christianity can not move to that stage without integrating in some way the other Abrahamic religions. That is to say, properly effecting them with what it has over them - the full fledged notion of the human.

It is quite wonderful that, despite the horrid facts on the ground, there is the truth that both Christianity and Islam are Hellenic, in their cultural origins.

Islam is also influenced deeply by the earlier moongod cults of that region, and it still has the moon, and a five pointed star (anciently representing Venus) as its symbols - it is essentially feminine.

With that, we should be able to work, in a lofty long term vision.

"but the postmodern new age leftist religion of Prozac CNN transhumanism is trying to force the ugly death upon Christianity, by turning it into something terrible... atheism is just one part of that. A real atheist has no reason to call himself an atheist, and no reason to try converting people to the new religion of the transhumanism Jesus-VR-Welfare world.

Disney is the new face of transhumanist PC neoliberal atheism and mindrape, masking itself as the smile of Jesus. "

Disney is indeed no less than the creator of a new religion. Hollywood followed in Disney's footsteps, basically, with its codes about god and evil.

At its best, Disney is glorious paganism. Hollywood, at best, is philosophy. Both of them carry potential for something real, for perhaps this very transformation of Christianity you allude to.

There is the will to morality without an invisible, unaccountable god, but there isnt the health, the strength and integrity to truly move toward it. Though in the best Hollywood films, the stars have been touched and drawn closer - and such films I mean franchises like The Terminator and Satr Wars - essentially science fiction is the arena in which future morality is investigated.

SciFi could aspire to replace religion, as a futural apex of the collective mind.



 

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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 12:48 pm

That's one reason I like the idea of space exploration and colonization. The moon and asteroids alone could provide limitless energy resources, and the fact of breaking out into space would deeply humanize humanity, and as you suggest I think would help create the next stage "religion" which post-Christianity won't be traditional religious at all but a kind of self-motivated and particular emotional-cognitive form of subjectivity that future people have.

The way we think and feel is the supreme issue here. Religions basically exist to help shape that. And per tectonics you can't just have a high plateau of emotive and cognitive power and perspective and self-power and self-perspective, it has to exist atop other ontic-causal structures. Each step in world-history is a substance that must be made.

What is clear to me is that advanced technology will play some key role in the future of human subjectivity, but we cannot allow the trans/nihilists to turn human minds into opiated mush within the VR Disney hologram world that will within our lifetimes be beamed directly into our "inner voice" and "inner eye" (for a price, of course, a monthly subscription or some similar manner of cash transaction). There is a war right now over what this future subjectivity vis a vis technological power will look like. Freedom and individuality must be protected against the formation of the hive mind.

If it can be protected, then this technology will become mastered by human subjectivity rather than become its master. Add to that space exploration that will be as well-developed and scaled up in manufacturing process as airline travel is now, and Christianity will give birth to its child, a love-child it must make with Fate; that child is simple the human mind-subjectivity of tomorrow. I have no way of knowing a timeline, but depending on circumstances it could happen within a century.

 

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"Do you hold out hope, then?" ... "I hold out dignity." ... "She will need opiates before long, for the pain. She will cease being who she is." ... "Then I will love who she becomes."  --Penny Dreadful
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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:07 pm

Fixed Cross wrote:
Sisyphus "A" = "A" is superstition. It projects a belief into the future, and then coerces the mathematician to absolutely believe in the justified outcome of this belief.

Why? Because there is no equality between objects in the world that can just be asserted by positing a letter. It's baloney. But baloney has its uses.

We can make another topic about this elsewhere. I respect your decision not to continue on this topic. I don't think Ive been understood very well, and thats fine. I would not even object to being scorned and ridiculed for espousing the very thing that in so many ways stands between man and philosophy.

Yes, perhaps a new thread for this so to not take this thread too far off topic.

I think our differences relate to subjective vs objective.
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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 4:34 pm

Islam gets that from all the way back in early Judaism, where you find the same oddly specific hygienic prescriptions and the like.


There is a context for these prescriptions that gets lost in the oral history, then they end up codifying them in text and it seems weird to us. Like "don't mix linen and wool at worship" or whatever it was, it was because that mixture will cause you to sweat profusely and it's difficult to focus on the divine mysteries when everyone around you reeks of desert-ass.


The Arabic female has been bred for 1500 years in submission. Hence, the eyes. They're deep but they hold nothing. Their strange depth asks one to give but they cannot hold anything, everything vanishes in their eyes like waves at sea. Pure submission is not feminine, nor is aggression masculine. Rather, femininity lies in the emotional intuitiveness of women; they can find all the seeds and promising imperfections in you, that even you cannot see, and then bring them to life; all their words and movements and gestures find a way to answer and harmonize your own words and movements and gestures, their whole organism is one big dance- they make you more than what you were before; their presence alone matures you, improves, consoles you, etc. A true female is even more than a muse; muses just inspire, and set there in silence, but women can assist you in working out the complexities and problems of your own nature, in a way that no other male ever could. A great book, discovering a new philosopher, even a film or a piece of music can change you as a person, but another human being... falling in love can change you and should change you a thousand times more than any of that. For no male can embrace the humanity in another male in that life-altering way.

And masculinity in essence is not aggression; the true male doesn't just force others to obey with a sword, rather, others want to obey, because they trust the male and they respect his competence and his ability to organize, plan, and lead.

 

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Nisus ait, "Dine hunc ardorem mentibus addunt,
Euryale, an sua cuique deus fit dira cupido?"

Have the gods set this ruling passion in my heart,
or does each man's furious passion become his god?
- Virgil.


It is not opium which makes me work but its absence, and in order for me to feel its absence it must
from time to time be present.-- Antonin Artaud
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PostSubject: Re: He that is most gracious, most merciful   Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:58 pm

Sent you a PM in more detail, Id just like to state that Ive found Arab women to be the proudest of all, - if they are the type for it. Which is rare. But not as rare as a proud white women. Of my age and below, Ive met one that was both to my taste and proud enough, and made her my girlfriend for some years. All the other ones have looked broken, lost to their body and heart.

Ive also traveled in the Arab world, and what you find indoors is invariably this: the mother has a seat proudly in the middle of the house, the small children are running around her, the older daughter has found a place to watch over the situation, and the onder sons and father are just hovering about, playfully, screwing around, talking or cursing - in full acknowledgement of the authority of the mother.

Of course it is entirely true that the ruling code submits these women in all legal cases, and puts men in seats of power. But what power is that really? all that they are is boys with weapons, and all they desire is to be desired, and not laughed at, by a woman.

Just as Mohamed was enabled by a business woman, it is women who keep Islam intact, who fight for their role as submitted - because it is there that they have their privilege - they dont need to waste themselves to careers that draw their souls out of them - they can just live, and commandeer their men around, because these men have to believe they're on top of things, and all these women have learned over time is to control the men with these means.

Behind all strong Arab forces there are women, and all Arab families Ive been invited into, Turkish as well for that matter, had the woman as the absolute center of authority - it is rather the men that are submissive - unless they happen to be warrior class people, which is rare in all cultures.

 

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